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joe biden simply dismantled the romney/ryan world view. but also talk about how the right wingers are trying to make a big deal out of joe biden's smile. so what? i would have been outright laughing in paul ryan's face. joe biden was fed up and who could blame him? >> with all due respect, that's a bunch of malarkey. >> and why is that so? >> because not a single thing he said is accurate. >> this is a bunch of stuff. >> what do you mean a bunch of stuff? >> it's simply inaccurate. >> it's irish. >> thanks for the translation. okay. >> malarkey. a bunch of stuff. i love it. i love it. biden systematically took apart ryan's arguments for less government, let's accountability, let's community. it got so bad, paul ryan was driven to drink. literally. he went back to that cup of water over and over again. by our last count, at least 21 time. what's the matter there, mr. ryan? got a little cotton mouth? last night the romney/ryan effort was exposed as a shield for the extreme far right and vice president biden drove that point home again and ag
joe biden simply dismantled the romney/ryan world view. but also talk about how the right wingers are trying to make a big deal out of joe biden's smile. so what? i would have been outright laughing in paul ryan's face. joe biden was fed up and who could blame him? >> with all due respect, that's a bunch of malarkey. >> and why is that so? >> because not a single thing he said is accurate. >> this is a bunch of stuff. >> what do you mean a bunch of stuff? >>...
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ryan infected by moderate massachusetts mitt romney? >> well, i think what you heard this morning when i asked him this question, and he as mitted there were differences between them but he also tried to say the differences between romney and ryan pale in comparison to the differences between the obama ticket and the romney ticket, but he seemed to indicate that ryan's job is to defend the romney plan and the romney budget. i do think what chris points out, that what biden's strategy is going to be is to try to create a split, is try to put him in an awkward position, make him defend one or the other. i think one thing to watch for tonight is it's my understanding -- from when i was talking to the campaigns, if they get one thing out of biden tonight, the obama campaign, that is to make the base of the democratic party feel better tonight, that he gets a little aggressive, that he goes after some core issues like abortion, like contraception to make the base feel better. on the ryan side, they know they sort of have in a weird way they
ryan infected by moderate massachusetts mitt romney? >> well, i think what you heard this morning when i asked him this question, and he as mitted there were differences between them but he also tried to say the differences between romney and ryan pale in comparison to the differences between the obama ticket and the romney ticket, but he seemed to indicate that ryan's job is to defend the romney plan and the romney budget. i do think what chris points out, that what biden's strategy is...
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. >> paul ryan set to clear any confusion about the romney/ryan ticket. >> i'm a pro-life candidate, i'll be a pro-life president. >> our position is consistent and hasn't changed. >> he can't clear up confusion on his own budget. >> i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all the math. >> oh, brother. just spin already. >> i just got to ask what's your personal best? >> 1under three. >> holy smoke. >> i stand by what i said, whatever it was. >>> we are pumped up, fired up, and jacked up with just hours until tonight's first and only face-off between vice president joseph biden and vice presidential nominee paul ryan. and what was once regarded as a popcorn side show has taken on far greater significance in the wake of the president's less than scintillating performance last week. democrats are anxious, republicans are hungry for a surge, and as ryan and biden take the stage tonight, they have a chance to influence this election at a volatile moment. and the president himself knows he's got to push harder against his ever-shifting rival. speaking just moments
. >> paul ryan set to clear any confusion about the romney/ryan ticket. >> i'm a pro-life candidate, i'll be a pro-life president. >> our position is consistent and hasn't changed. >> he can't clear up confusion on his own budget. >> i don't have the time -- it would take me too long to go through all the math. >> oh, brother. just spin already. >> i just got to ask what's your personal best? >> 1under three. >> holy smoke. >> i stand...
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or are you running and paul ryan as part of the romney/ryan ticket? how much should we expect to hear tonight about the way paul ryan comported himself in the house of representatives? >> well, you know, rachel, mitt romney and paul ryan campaigned all throughout the state of wisconsin during the republican primaries, where mitt romney completely wrapped his arms around paul ryan's policies. paul ryan's budget. i think that is going to be a piece of the discussion tonight and i think that is, you know, part of what the american people need to decide on, whether or not they want a budget that protects tax cuts for those at the top but is cutting education, and veterans and clean energy, innovation, infrastructure, turning medicare into a voucher program. those are the types of choices that the meamerican people have before them and that will be part of the discussion tonight. >> you said earlier today, stephanie, that paul ryan and mitt romney are politicizing the attack in benghazi that killed our ambassador there. the republican national committee re
or are you running and paul ryan as part of the romney/ryan ticket? how much should we expect to hear tonight about the way paul ryan comported himself in the house of representatives? >> well, you know, rachel, mitt romney and paul ryan campaigned all throughout the state of wisconsin during the republican primaries, where mitt romney completely wrapped his arms around paul ryan's policies. paul ryan's budget. i think that is going to be a piece of the discussion tonight and i think that...
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of medicaid. >> romney/ryan tax plan will raise taxes on middle-class families with a child, one or more children by an additional $2,000 a year. >> don't tell me what you value. show me your budget and i'll tell you what the value. >>> vice president biden will have some serious things to say this thursday. joining me is steve carnaci, co-host of "the cycle. he's writing in "salon" today about paul ryan's thing skin. thanks for coming on the show. >> thanks for having me. is he ready for joe biden? >> it's an open question. one thing we found is he hasn't been ready forred kind of scrutiny that comes with a national spot light. there have been several interviews, in what we all assumed would be friendly turf fox news where at the slightest bit of scrutiny on follow-up questions he's gotten very testy and evasive. you can think of early on back in august in an interview, how long it would take mitt romney's budget to be balance. he said i don't want to be all wonky on you, but i don't know. and chris wallace started grilling him, a promise it will be deficit neutral and very vague p
of medicaid. >> romney/ryan tax plan will raise taxes on middle-class families with a child, one or more children by an additional $2,000 a year. >> don't tell me what you value. show me your budget and i'll tell you what the value. >>> vice president biden will have some serious things to say this thursday. joining me is steve carnaci, co-host of "the cycle. he's writing in "salon" today about paul ryan's thing skin. thanks for coming on the show. >>...
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romney said today under duress that the romney/ryan position is the romney/ryan position, there's no difference between them. and he said you'll hear more about it at the vice presidential debate tomorrow. i bet you will. joining us now is steve kornacki, co-host of "the cycle." thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> the democrats have been aggressive in driving their campaigning on this issue, because they think that's a key issue for locking up the women's vote. with this walkback, this attempted and failed walkback that happened within the last 24 hours from the romney campaign, do you think that's going to have an impact there? >> yeah. there's some interesting data that came out in the last few days which i think is what was initially behind what mitt romney said, taking a more moderate position on abortion. first you had this poll that came out in ohio, showing obama ahead of romney by four. the gender gap in this thing was astounding. among men, romney had a 16-point lead in ohio. among women, 60-38, obama. that is like a 38-point gender gap. i have not seen someth
romney said today under duress that the romney/ryan position is the romney/ryan position, there's no difference between them. and he said you'll hear more about it at the vice presidential debate tomorrow. i bet you will. joining us now is steve kornacki, co-host of "the cycle." thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> the democrats have been aggressive in driving their campaigning on this issue, because they think that's a key issue for locking up the women's...
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while ryan voted for bailout, how will that be handle fd it comes up tonight, the ryan/romney -- >> this is someone who has been a hero of right wing idealogs. he is going to go out there before the american people and renounce what his entire career has been, which is working and working as part of the right-wing republican caucus and being a champion. is he going to sell that out on the national stage? >> catch up with chris hayes saturdays and sundays from 8:00 a.m. to 10:00 a.m. eastern and krystal on "the cycle" right here at 3:00 prk m. on msnbc. >>> coming up, shocking comments from an ally of paul ryan. comments that are now forcing mr. ryan to drop his old friend after he says, quote, some girls rate easy. >>> plus, new problems for moderate mitt romney. a new tape from three years ago surfaces. this time, he's praising glenn beck. >>> and great news, things are getting better so the right-wing conspiracy theorists have hit the halls of congress. you're watching a special edition of "politicsnation." as we get ready for the big vice president debate in kentucky, the place for po
while ryan voted for bailout, how will that be handle fd it comes up tonight, the ryan/romney -- >> this is someone who has been a hero of right wing idealogs. he is going to go out there before the american people and renounce what his entire career has been, which is working and working as part of the right-wing republican caucus and being a champion. is he going to sell that out on the national stage? >> catch up with chris hayes saturdays and sundays from 8:00 a.m. to 10:00 a.m....
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isn't ryan supposed to be the brain of the romney campaign and we're lacking specifics? i mean, wasn't that a poor explanation? >> well, yes, and let me give you his idea of a study. he said there are six studies. three of those six studies are blog posts and one of them is by a research assistant at aei, which is one of the big ideological marketing organizations that pitch you their view of the world just the way companies advertise other products. but blog posts, those are studies that prove things? that's hilarious. >> why doesn't the plan add up? why doesn't his so-called plan for america, the 20% cut, add up? where's the flaw? >> well, it does add up for the very rich. if you listen very carefully to what romney always says, he says he's going to cut rates 20% and then he's going to see to it that those at the top don't pay a larger share of the total tax burden. well, that means that they're going to get a huge decrease in their tax bill. that's the important element. that is the ryan/romney plan, it is to create dynastic wealth which i think would be devastating
isn't ryan supposed to be the brain of the romney campaign and we're lacking specifics? i mean, wasn't that a poor explanation? >> well, yes, and let me give you his idea of a study. he said there are six studies. three of those six studies are blog posts and one of them is by a research assistant at aei, which is one of the big ideological marketing organizations that pitch you their view of the world just the way companies advertise other products. but blog posts, those are studies that...
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the romney/ryan spending plan here. but last night martha raddatz's questioning and joe biden's badgering got paul ryan to disavow this plan altogether saying he does not want an increase at all despite the fact it is what he and mr. romney has been campaigning on. paul ryan broke new ground on saying how and why he and mitt romney would overturn roe v. wade and make abortion criminal. his issue on rape in particular has people going nuts today for obvious reasons. we'll be covering that in future shows. joe biden also dipped paul ryan in tar and rolled him in feathers on the issue of the stimulus. and mr. ryan's supposed principles on that issue. we talked about that moments ago with chris hayes. but there are two things that i think are hugely important to the presidential campaign that happened last night. two things that i, frankly, never thought we would get to. and that we got to and, boy, howdy, is this new territory. first was this. >> you asked, do i feel free? let me put it to you this way. i earned capital in
the romney/ryan spending plan here. but last night martha raddatz's questioning and joe biden's badgering got paul ryan to disavow this plan altogether saying he does not want an increase at all despite the fact it is what he and mr. romney has been campaigning on. paul ryan broke new ground on saying how and why he and mitt romney would overturn roe v. wade and make abortion criminal. his issue on rape in particular has people going nuts today for obvious reasons. we'll be covering that in...
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biden was defending the middle class while ryan was defending romney. biden's greatest asset was his passion though he might have been over the top. it was possible for a viewer to conclude that he was simply passionate about the middle class. take a look at joe biden early in the debate going after romney on his 47% comments. >> but it shouldn't be surprising for a guy who says 47% of the american people are unwilling to take responsibility for their own lives. my friend recently in a speech in washington said 30% of the american people are takers. these people are my mom and dad, the people i grew up with, my neighbors. they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. i have had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here, and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> joe klein, that's
biden was defending the middle class while ryan was defending romney. biden's greatest asset was his passion though he might have been over the top. it was possible for a viewer to conclude that he was simply passionate about the middle class. take a look at joe biden early in the debate going after romney on his 47% comments. >> but it shouldn't be surprising for a guy who says 47% of the american people are unwilling to take responsibility for their own lives. my friend recently in a...
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now we're coming up to romney and ryan. not this debate specifically coming after president obama's gaffe before. >> that was a big thing for everybody here in the room. this was a big debate obviously because of president obama's performance last time. glen, that's why you paid a lot of attention here tonight, correct? >> yes, i think biden came on real strong and confident. i think he needed to do that because obama's performance last week was disappointing. >> and do you think the president will be up to it now that the bar's been raised next week? >> we'll see. >> you're still undecided. >> yes. >> sam, you're still undecided. you gave me an answer earlier. you said, you know, they've been running for president for months and months and months. you have the internet, newspapers, radio, tv. you're getting bombarded by ads here. why can't you make up your mind? >> as i said before, we work for a living. you know, a lot of us get up at 4:00 a.m., go to work for 12, 14 hours. we're at home with our kids. we're not doing thi
now we're coming up to romney and ryan. not this debate specifically coming after president obama's gaffe before. >> that was a big thing for everybody here in the room. this was a big debate obviously because of president obama's performance last time. glen, that's why you paid a lot of attention here tonight, correct? >> yes, i think biden came on real strong and confident. i think he needed to do that because obama's performance last week was disappointing. >> and do you...
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for paul ryan it's defending had his own record as well as mitt romney's record. they're different. as joe biden tries to remain gaffe-free and make up for the president's poor performance last week. and joining me now, democratic strategist and president of divine, and phil, republican consultant and president of new frontier strategy both whom have been debate preppers in the past. what was going through your mind when watching president obama last week? >> listen, i think as his campaign has conceded it was a tough night for the president and governor romney did well. what i was thinking they're going to have to pivot. we're at a pivot point in this campaign. a lot of the republicans who probably would have wound up with romney anyways have made the polls closer and the vice presidential debate will be an important one. >> and what would your advice be to joe biden in terms of being tougher but not too tough? what is the mix that he has to get through? he's got a pretty rich amount of material to go through because if he wants to go after the ryan budget cuts and medicare plan, n
for paul ryan it's defending had his own record as well as mitt romney's record. they're different. as joe biden tries to remain gaffe-free and make up for the president's poor performance last week. and joining me now, democratic strategist and president of divine, and phil, republican consultant and president of new frontier strategy both whom have been debate preppers in the past. what was going through your mind when watching president obama last week? >> listen, i think as his...
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ryan said last night to governor romney was a car guy. well, if they had an elevator stack i guess he was. >> today the campaigning continues the post debate campaigning has already kicked into high gear. >> we're going to level the playing field. it's time to acknowledge what got us into this trouble in the first place. >> the vice president defends the status quo. >> that's a bunch of ma larky. the. >> paul ryan care about each and every american. >> stop caring about how you care about people. show me something. >> the table is now reset. >> with the v.p. debate now over. >> who gets to hit the panic button next? >> with 25 days until the presidential election, the obama re-election campaign is seizing on this statement by paul ryan in last night's debate. >> if the romney/ryan ticket is elected, should those who believe that abortion should remain legal be worried? >> we don't think that unelected judges should make this decision, that people through their elected representatives, in reaching a consensus in society through a democrati
ryan said last night to governor romney was a car guy. well, if they had an elevator stack i guess he was. >> today the campaigning continues the post debate campaigning has already kicked into high gear. >> we're going to level the playing field. it's time to acknowledge what got us into this trouble in the first place. >> the vice president defends the status quo. >> that's a bunch of ma larky. the. >> paul ryan care about each and every american. >> stop...
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mitt romney called paul ryan today as well, wished him luck. both sides gearing up for this. you mentioned that achille's foot. some analysts say in this kind of format, the vice president won't slip up. >> in debates, particularly against sarah palin four years ago, he was pretty disciplined. i think republicans would be unwise to count on a biden gaffe occurring during this debate. >> senior democrat told me a short time ago where the vice president does get in trouble is not in this format, but a tv interview and he starts winding around and telling a long story and goes off message. another thing to watch tonight is that this is not just domestic policy like the first debate. it's foreign policy as well. that terrorist attack in libya could come up tonight for the first time in one of these debates. >> shep: yeah, i would be surprised if it didn't. what's the obama campaign telling you about the strategy and taking on congressman ryan? >> they're saying to me in private that he's not really just taking on congressman ryan. the plan, the strategy is to go after the top of
mitt romney called paul ryan today as well, wished him luck. both sides gearing up for this. you mentioned that achille's foot. some analysts say in this kind of format, the vice president won't slip up. >> in debates, particularly against sarah palin four years ago, he was pretty disciplined. i think republicans would be unwise to count on a biden gaffe occurring during this debate. >> senior democrat told me a short time ago where the vice president does get in trouble is not in...
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i think on both scores, ryan will really help romney. we have to realize how much of obama's appeal is generational. when you you are putting on a v.p. debate with a 25 or 25-year, i guess, difference in age, and one who is kind of a haggard regular old-time bomb baftic politician, and the other, a very incisive, sharp, focused policy person, i think that you really are going to see ryan have a tremendous edge. the other thing is that ryan wrote the romney program. this is not just a candidate for v.p., his the intellectual leader of the republican party today. for him to be up there debating in a political debate is like, you know, it's like mickey mantle coming to bat because he -- he wrote all of these programs. he knows these budgets. he knows these figures and biden is only vaguely aqaipted with them. i think ryan is going to do extremely well and that will be decisive. i think we are looking now at a whole new band of states coming into play, michigan, pennsylvania, new jersey. a bunch of states that nobody would have thought near
i think on both scores, ryan will really help romney. we have to realize how much of obama's appeal is generational. when you you are putting on a v.p. debate with a 25 or 25-year, i guess, difference in age, and one who is kind of a haggard regular old-time bomb baftic politician, and the other, a very incisive, sharp, focused policy person, i think that you really are going to see ryan have a tremendous edge. the other thing is that ryan wrote the romney program. this is not just a candidate...
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six studies say the romney/ryan math adds up. the talking point's been so great that a top romney adviser took it for a spin over to the home field this weekend. and he wasn't expecting this. >> six different studies have said this is entirely doable. >> that wasn't the question. some of them are blog and independent groups. >> these are very credible sources and -- >> one of them is a from a guy who -- a blog from a top adviser to george w. bush. these are hardly nonpartisan studies. >> chris, i think if you look at harvard and aei, they are very credible sources. >> you wouldn't say that aei is a conservative think tank? >> it's a light leaning think tank but that doesn't make it uncredible. >> it doesn't make it partisan. >> two blogs from the conservative think tank, american enterprise institute. another nonpartisan study is from the conservative think tank, the heritage foundation. their own website said that it's a paper written by, ready for this one, a former bush adviser. study number five, five says -- is written by "t
six studies say the romney/ryan math adds up. the talking point's been so great that a top romney adviser took it for a spin over to the home field this weekend. and he wasn't expecting this. >> six different studies have said this is entirely doable. >> that wasn't the question. some of them are blog and independent groups. >> these are very credible sources and -- >> one of them is a from a guy who -- a blog from a top adviser to george w. bush. these are hardly...
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ryan saying mitt romney's performance makes it more difficult for him. people are suggesting that vice president joe biden is gaffe-ridden and incompetent. what are you expecting from this debate? >> i will go ahead and i would say i'd set the bar pretty high for biden because i think he's a much better debater than obama. one of the reasons biden ended up on the ticket with obama in 2008 was that in 2007 and 2008 running against hillary clinton, running against barack obama, it was biden who are often than not who would steal the show at those democratic debates. it never actually translated into votes for him but he impressed people in the obama campaign as somebody they wanted to have out there. you go farther back in his career when he first ran for president in 1988, he got derailed by a bit of a plagiarism scandal, but when he was using his own words, he was one heck of an orator. that was his reputation. a really strong communicator. i look at biden and his debate skills and communication skills, and i say escapable of doing what barack obama eith
ryan saying mitt romney's performance makes it more difficult for him. people are suggesting that vice president joe biden is gaffe-ridden and incompetent. what are you expecting from this debate? >> i will go ahead and i would say i'd set the bar pretty high for biden because i think he's a much better debater than obama. one of the reasons biden ended up on the ticket with obama in 2008 was that in 2007 and 2008 running against hillary clinton, running against barack obama, it was biden...
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ryan said that governor romney was a car guy. if they have an elevator stacked on their couch, i guess he was. >> there was one person on stage who was thought full, respect l respectful, steady and poised, the kind of person you want to turn to in a crisis and that was the next vice president of the united states, paul ryan. i see these obama rallies and they're chanting four more years. our cheer is four more weeks. >> guys, i have to say, that was easily my most favorite debate of the season so far. i think biden was the clear winner, gave democrats the shot of energy they needed, hammered them on the 47%, hammered him on lying, said the facts matter. the moment where they talked about abortion was so destructive because ryan said i'm going to make you all do what i believe in my catholic doctrine and biden said, hey, i believe this, i respect catholic doctrine but i'll let you do what you want to do and made the case that the supreme court is in the balance. but one of the things that i like -- i noticed that ryan can't expla
ryan said that governor romney was a car guy. if they have an elevator stacked on their couch, i guess he was. >> there was one person on stage who was thought full, respect l respectful, steady and poised, the kind of person you want to turn to in a crisis and that was the next vice president of the united states, paul ryan. i see these obama rallies and they're chanting four more years. our cheer is four more weeks. >> guys, i have to say, that was easily my most favorite debate...
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>> mitt romney put paul ryan on the ticket. that's not running away from the plan. >> but i mean -- he didn't embrace the ryan budget. it was too tough for him perhaps? >> correct me if i'm wrong, my understanding governor romney has been complimentary of the ryan budget plan and recognizes that we need to make reforms so that the big entitlement programs will be there for the next generation we need to tighten the belt on discreti discretionary spending. i disagree. >> mitt romney's tax proposals, because he has said that he can cut taxes without blowing up the deficit, without being deficit neutral, and at the same time keep defense spending. >> yeah. >> increase the defense budget. how does that work? >> governor romney said he can lower marginal tax rates and generate offsetting revenue so we don't increase the side of the deficit. >> how do you generate that? >> you reduce the number of write-offs and loopholes in some combinations. >> which would you reduce? he's not been specific. >> he's provided more specificity than t
>> mitt romney put paul ryan on the ticket. that's not running away from the plan. >> but i mean -- he didn't embrace the ryan budget. it was too tough for him perhaps? >> correct me if i'm wrong, my understanding governor romney has been complimentary of the ryan budget plan and recognizes that we need to make reforms so that the big entitlement programs will be there for the next generation we need to tighten the belt on discreti discretionary spending. i disagree. >>...
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paul ryan laid out what the romney/ryan agenda would be for the future. you didn't hear anything new at all from vice president biden about what the obama administration's going to do to get down unemployment, to spark growth. all the things they've been failing at. they have laid out no vision at all to address that. >> his point was that vice president joe biden was inappropriate and insubstantial. what was your take? >> i thought he was passionate. i thought he was personal and i thought he was very substantial. i thought he really won the debate. i think that he was willing to be specific in a way paul ryan wasn't. i think paul ryan did not have an answer to the question of what's your $5 trillion tax plan, what exactly what benefits are you going to cut? what exactly are you going to do? i don't think he had an answer on afghanistan. the only thing paul ryan had a specific answer on he and romney are willing to take away a woman's right to choose. >> if you look at what happened afterwards and hearing the talking heads this morning, democrats thought
paul ryan laid out what the romney/ryan agenda would be for the future. you didn't hear anything new at all from vice president biden about what the obama administration's going to do to get down unemployment, to spark growth. all the things they've been failing at. they have laid out no vision at all to address that. >> his point was that vice president joe biden was inappropriate and insubstantial. what was your take? >> i thought he was passionate. i thought he was personal and i...
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the president's team said the debate exposed the risk of electing a romney/ryan ticket. the candidate also disagreed over foreign policy. congressman ryan pointing to the death of four americans in libya as the administration weakness on abroad while biden said romney's campaign talks first before they know what the facts are. back to you. >>> that cbs news poll found the overall impressions of both vice presidential candidate improved after the debate. 55% of those asked if bid inis somebody they can relate to. 48% for ryan. 74% also say that about ryan about being knowledgeable and 85 for biden. >>> cbsnews.com senior political reporter breaks down last night's faceoff. >> reporter: joe biden came out very aggressive in this debate and maintained that tone throughout. to republicans he was rude. they were using the word unhinged, complaining about his smirking. for democrats it's exactly what they wanted to see. a week ago president obama was very passive in his debate against mitt romney. it was frustrating for democrats. they wanted to see him take to it mitt romney.
the president's team said the debate exposed the risk of electing a romney/ryan ticket. the candidate also disagreed over foreign policy. congressman ryan pointing to the death of four americans in libya as the administration weakness on abroad while biden said romney's campaign talks first before they know what the facts are. back to you. >>> that cbs news poll found the overall impressions of both vice presidential candidate improved after the debate. 55% of those asked if bid inis...
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and the romney ryan one of the vents during the summit your way out the romney ryan plan obviously has holes in it and when you talk about these things and the reasonable thing that we can talk about is that when they say they're going to close loopholes they really haven't addressed specifics and there's a reason for that this is politically toxic to try and do that because there's a lot of industries and a lot of voters who are waiting so they see the reality they don't have the same time though the same time you can get all you want but at the same time when it comes to the path to prosperity i think that ryan is being honest there with the prospect of a lot some place but ryan's way out there and it's plain but that's that's that's when you're running on there's no there's no hollowness to the reality that we are heading towards a fiscal cliff and the only ticket this really looking to address that right now is the republican ticket there's no question of us as you say and this is part of the problem the problem that you have is you have the president who's laid out specifically wa
and the romney ryan one of the vents during the summit your way out the romney ryan plan obviously has holes in it and when you talk about these things and the reasonable thing that we can talk about is that when they say they're going to close loopholes they really haven't addressed specifics and there's a reason for that this is politically toxic to try and do that because there's a lot of industries and a lot of voters who are waiting so they see the reality they don't have the same time...